Myth busted: Can you run sway/wayland’s i3 without systemd or elogind?

For those who want to skip the discussion and get right to it follow the steps at this README

For a while, we have heard this justification, among distributions that have refused systemd as init, that elogind was adopted as a necessity for running wayland which is the future of graphical desktops.  Some future this is, but anyway.  For Artix it was a day one decision, for Void and Adelie it has been a year or more, for Slackware a few months.  But it is only a handful of distros at this point that have totally refused the use of elogind and stick to consolekit2 (which was recently upgraded upstream unlike common myth that has it abandoned).  Consolekit2 can handle logind functionality but can’t provide seat management.  So there is seatd, a daemon that just does this.  So count the different functions, unrelated to each other, that systemd provides all in one huge blob. Continue reading

Popular mythology spread by IBM parrots elogind vs consolekit2 1.2.2

Thanks to the great work by Eric Koegel and Antoine Jacoutot we were not wrong again!

Parrots never think of what it is they say, they hear things (generally things are heard through highly paid and supported media that serve corporate and state interests) and reproduce the sound of them.  Not that they are dumb, but they can’t process rational language based communication. 

QUESTION: Why are you dumping consolekit2 and use elogind, that you know is just a significant piece of systemd, which further makes upstream reliance to systemd more acceptable and wide spread?

EXCUSE:  Consolekit is deprecated, it is unmaintained, it will never work with Wayland, and we must support wayland because that is the future.

QUESTION: Could consolekit2 be able to work with wayland?

EXCUSE: No, it never will!

QUESTION: Elogind, being a piece of the most convoluted piece of opensource software ever encountered is very big.  Shouldn’t this be a performance concern?

EXCUSE: No, because consolekit was also huge!


ANSWER:  Consolekit2 1.2.2 was released Dec.20 2020 and among its changes is a memory leak fix, NetBSD/OpenBSD fixes/compliance and more.  If you notice in the list of issues and discussion there has been a workaround to get ck2 to work with wayland in Gentoo since 2018. 

Consolekit2 is between a 1/5 to 1/6 of the size of elogind!


Continue reading

Boot/Shutdown console output on obarun or any 66 driven distribution

A hint/trick to control console output during booting and shutdown/reboot.

Users come in all shapes and forms.  Some users dislike looking at too much output on their console while the system is booting, while others like to see more, so if something is wrong they pick it up right away and go fix it and reboot.  Some prefer the aesthetics of looking at a splash screen (defined in their grub, lilo, or syslinux configuration).  With Obarun and any distribution 66 is installed not many complain about too much output, quite the opposite, people see very little and then either a console login prompt appears (indicating booting is complete and all predetermined services are up and running) or a display manager has kicked in and off they are to a graphic login screen. Continue reading

New blood, new linux distributions without systemd

LogoTwo new distributions (Sulinox and Split Linux) to keep an eye on were added on our 2 lists of systemd without systemd.  The early first list of all systems we know without systemd (including BSD varieties) and our more detailed list of 66 linux distributions without systemd.

SulinosThe first is called Sulinox, an independent linux distribution, built on glibc with OpenRC as init, a base software available on repositories with a few varieties of desktops, and elogind present, available for X86_64 architectures.  The distribution is aimed at expert users who know and like to build packages from source.  To do so in a more organized way and maintain system integrity Sulinox has developed their own package manager called inary.  For those of you who like to keep an eye on the source repository of a distribution and follow development in detail we warn you that comments are in Turkish, although the rest of the documentation for the distro and the package manager is written in English. Continue reading

5 Does the “typical linux user” have anything to gain over traditional scripts?

This is article 5 from the latest proposed list of topics

Probably the most valuable content this community has produced was condemned by immaturity and lack of organization (on our part) to set the parameters of the procedure within which a productive debate can occur.

One of the reasons people without bosses, authoritarian structures, fail to organize and formulate their own power structures is because they have been conditioned to be vicious aformalists (anti or non formalists in terms of organizational tendency).  Individuals born and raised within this patriarchal system of authority can only behave like spoiled children all their life.  Sorry cynwulf1 and mobinmob, but you used and abused your expertise to block all other possible participants and concentrated on your own duel of expertise competition.

The content of your expert testimonies may be of value, but next time something like this happens fungalnet is not going to be here and be nice, you will be moderated and either respect an open process discussion or you can take your dialogs somewhere else.  Imagine if in a Union meeting two characters, with very accute and experienced authoritative voices,  converted the meeting into a dialog where everyone else was forced to be quiet and listen,  Two people from within an amphitheater, can dominate nad hijack all discussion to what they think the object of the meeting is.  Not here, not again!

Fungalnet failed to set the rules of a debate, it occured in a totally unrelated subject, fungalnet let it go on, you both ignored fungalnet trying to present the case of “the average linux user”, and now the question still remains open.  Neither of you, consumed in your own expert testimony, were able to convince (we believe) for either or.

The question remains,  should we “average linux users” (who may use a workstation for editing text, browsing the net, manipulating images, video, or audio, or who may be an average linux admin hosting a home or small office network of file, mail, firewall, backup, print, and other servers).  Are scripts as found in Antix or Open/Free{BSD}, enough, or are supervision suites such as those of Void, Obarun, Adelie, Spark, Artix, a benefit to users?

Continue reading

Coming up next the new sysdfree resurrection

Just so when “some” were happy this is done and over with, POP goes the sysdfree community project again.  From now on, we will have a summary article of what is coming up next, and a series of articles discussing in detail the most worthy or note-worthy topics of interest.  Since  YOU haven’t been contributiong much to the community, it will be OUR topics of interest.

Why did we vanish for a little while?  After all this closure and prohibition to end the covid diaspora we have been burning some skinny road bike tires enjoying the end of spring and the starrt of a very HOT summer.  So now that it is getting hot, we will stay indoors again enough to write something up.  Yeeahhheee!!!! Or is it Yaaayyyy….!!!

1  Devuan:  Boring new stable release a year later  (you wanted an article .. go find one elsewhere).

2  Debian:  Script that runs and removes systemd and installs sysvinit and reboots to a systemd init free system.

3  Adelie (and Alpine) free and non-free independent repository

4  Black Artix, as if Artix wasn’t shady enough

5  Adequacy of traditions scripts (sysV or BSD inits) necessity of supervision suites (s6, 66, synit, minit, perp) or other alternatives such as OpenRC.

6  Split Linux, based on Void, security, anonymity, real firewalling, and more ….

7  Enough with supervising dry-cut monolythic services, the future is in modules (modular services and bundles of services).  If systemd was already burried and done with, this builds a pyramid on top, just so nobody will ever dear to open the mummy’s coffin.

8  Live streaming with Terry Barentsen on 2 wheels, no gas or dirty coal electric motors!

9  Kiss gets a new package manager

10  The shit (green energy environmental disaster) has to stop.  A documentary about the end of the planet’s ecosystem and who are the deceiving actors causing it.  It may be the most revealing 100′ of your life, or at least your recent world perception.

11  A song for our own resurrection:

            __________   –  “*”  –   __________ Continue reading

Void vs the XBPS owner vs a toilet wiping Blogger

Mark 24th of April 2020 as another sad day for Linux without systemd.  Void is undergoing yet another crisis.  They might as well rename the project Drama Queen OS, or they may all be old 1968 activists drawing attention by theatricals and shocking the community to advertise their existence (there are always users out listening to stories asking “what the hell is Void?”).  The story is definitely worth everyone’s attention, or at least everyone who may be thinking some time in the future to contribute and join an open/free software project.  How should or shouldn’t such projects run.  This is the case study of DramaQueenOS (aka Void Linux).

You may ask, don’t you have anything more positive to write about but after a month sysdfree comes out with another article of negativity?  It is called critical thinking, you should look it up.  Adelie is still not officially stable (1.0rc is out testing), Obarun is expanding its array of system service management tools (soon to be announced I think), antiX is fine-tuning its kick-butt 19 edition (no word of any further development with runit or s6), Void has been dropped from being closely monitored, due to disappointment, over a month ago by the way they remove packages and how they alert users of doing so, and especially by the way they react to inquiring on their how they do it.  There are a couple of articles being worked on, one is a presentation of a new Manjaro based distribution, by the name of Mabox (Manjaro + OpenBox) and how it can be decontaminated by throwing systemd out and installing s6/66 instead, the other is a tiny system called OperWRT intended for embeded wifi router systems, and also FatDog, the fattest Puppy we have ever liked to play with.  But this late Void fiasco calls immediate critical attention. Continue reading

Spark Linux – Arch beauty and minimalism all in one

A while ago, an Obarun user, Dr Saleem Khan (1) urged me to try Spark Linux and it was the first time I heard of it.  It must have been during some real busy period and it was since forgotten.  While I was trying to clean up the list of linux distributions without systemd the name came up again.  Thanks, Saleem.

By no means do I think this is for entry level users to try as a distribution with a full desktop, but for minimalists who are accustomed to arch this is an exercise of how minimal can you get with a ready off the shelf arch base on which you can build from ground up.

The project is severely undocumented, although there is not much to document for an experienced user. Spark (by Jack L. Frost) uses sinit as its init system and ssm which is an inhouse Simple Service Manager by Spark founder.

Sinit according to its source suckless (they suck less) is:

sinit – suckless init

sinit is a suckless init, initially based on Rich Felker’s minimal init.

sinit is considered complete and no further development is expected to happen.

Relevant links sinit + daemontools-encore

sinit was created by Dimitris Papastamos and was “finished” in 2015, that I believe is a year after runit was finished as a frame of reference.
Continue reading

Did you think Void was more democratic than r/linux or r/ArchLinux ?

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How can Void be best the one day malware the next?

How can someone here, defend Void’s honor from a tremendously sloppy and unjustified criticism by the corporate rag (as in the piece of cloth used to wipe genitals after corporations take a crap, and they do all the time, especially on May Day and when strikes and mass protests are taking place around their headquarters) “distrowatch” ….  and the very next day attack void as being the worst form of malware that has hit the open and free software world?

Basically we are not a “fan club”, defending anyone as being god, or hating someone as being the antigod.   Criticism, for those that understand the term within rational thinking, has to and must be objective, to the best reasonable effort (that is all we human can do).  Only then can there be a dialectical agreement about reality, our best interpretation of it.  Despite of how many of you here, feel like they are finding a home at this systemd hate club of hooligans, enjoying braking knee caps of their opponents.  No, it is all objective criticism at something that is gradually becoming a “social danger”.  It is the Trojan Horse (and damn the damn Greeks for inventing this strategy to defeat the peace-loving Thracians and take over their land and resources, which they did, that is not Homer’s mythology but a historic fact) that is used by mega corporations to swallow and end this industry of open and free software, running on non-open and non-free hardware in lack of an alternative, which should be a social goal.  In this respect open and free software is an industry from those below against the interests of those above, a miracle or a mistake by those that rule and dominate.

Continue reading

Void-Linux reviewed by Distrowatch

distrowatch.com reviews void

After the injustices done on Antix (reviewed 5 years ago but allowing all kinds of trolls to keep posting unsubstantiated negative remarks) and Obarun, it was Void’s turn to be reminded to pay dues to Distrowatch, otherwise the review will be sloppy and negative.

While Void’s installer feels like a throwback to the 90s in its style and resembles the installers of BSDs and Slackware in its approach, it works quickly and experienced users should have no problem navigating its options Continue reading

How does systemd prevail if it is so crappy?

Is reddit’s r/linux just a front of IBM’s marketing agents?  Under what remote logic would an announcement for a 5 year old distribution be removed and how could it possibly violate r/linux strict code of ethics?

Obarun: New for December …. upgraded yes, new not at all.
Sorry, this post has been removed by the moderators of r/linux.
Moderators remove posts from feeds for a variety of reasons, including keeping communities safe, civil, and true to their purpose

Those are the same tactics utilized across news-sites that appear to be “objectively” promoting linux in general, forums of systemd-only distributions, social media rooms and pages. The idea is to portray linux to new users inquiring about linux while on MSwindows, MACos, Android etc. as a systemd related operating system ONLY. Continue reading